CNN "CNN Newsroom" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Mark Green (R-TN)
Interview
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JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR, NEWSROOM: -- it did a review, as required by law. It looked at corruption. And a letter was sent to all the relevant committees saying, we have looked at it and Ukraine is proceeding on anti-corruption efforts to our satisfaction.
So the Pentagon --
REP. MARK GREEN (R-TN), OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE: Sure.
SCIUTTO: -- which is closer to this issue than anyone, it had already certified that --
GREEN: Sure.
SCIUTTO: -- the money was going to the right place.
GREEN: Absolutely. And the Pentagon should have a say in that, but so should State. I mean, the Department of State should also have a say in that. And so I think the president was just listening to everyone and forming an opinion about whether or not, you know, it was going to go to the right place.
And, remember, the Ukrainians did nothing to get the aid started back again. So it started as soon as -- I think it was Senator Portman who actually went over and came back to the president and said, look, this guy is serious about addressing corruption in Ukraine. And very shortly after that conversation, the aid started back again.
SCIUTTO: Let me ask you this. Because you and I have spoken a number of times and --
GREEN: Yes, sir.
SCIUTTO: -- you're interested in fairness, you've made a lot of public statements about the fairness of this process.
GREEN: Sure, sure.
SCIUTTO: As you know, the White House has blocked from testifying, virtually all the senior White House officials involved in these decisions -- Bolton, Mulvaney, et cetera -- as well as refused to supply documents, e-mails, et cetera. Does that strike you as a fair participation in this process? GREEN: You know, I would like to see the president articulating the executive privilege and say, this is executive privilege. But he does have that right to say, hey, this is something that we believe could, you know, hurt the United States or hurt his discussions with his advisors. You know, courts have ruled in the past that the president can protect those conversations, so I'm supportive of that. I'd just like to see a little more, you know, articulation about the protection of those things.
SCIUTTO: Should it be -- as you know, the president's lawyers have claimed absolute immunity. I wonder, as a sitting member of Congress, would you be comfortable with a Democratic president claiming absolute immunity over all conversations that that president has with any advisor over anything? Is that a precedent we want for this country?
GREEN: Sure. I think it depends on how they articulate it, you know? I want to hear, OK, this is why I can't have this conversation released to the public. With that statement, I would accept it.
SCIUTTO: OK, fair answer.
Let me ask you this. Because at the heart of this, right, is an allegation that the president and his personal lawyer, central to it, was --
GREEN: Sure.
SCIUTTO: -- running, in effect, a shadow foreign policy and seeking to dig up dirt, political dirt on a possible opponent for the president in 2020. As we speak, it's notable that Rudy Giuliani is back in Ukraine, he's meeting with friendly former prosecutors, he's meeting with members of parliament there -- pro-Russian members of parliament, I should note -- in Ukraine, digging up political dirt again.
Do you believe --
GREEN: Sure.
SCIUTTO: -- that's where the president's personal lawyer should be now, and is that acceptable as we have an election coming?
GREEN: You raise sort of a point that is one side of the coin. The other side of that coin is, is you've got people like Vindman who really wants to push his agenda in foreign policy and not support the president's agenda. So why wouldn't the president kind of go around that and send his own voice over there to speak for him?
You know, he's the elected president of the United States, 63 million- plus people chose him and said, here, you direct the foreign policy of this nation. Yet we've got these bureaucrats who think they can just undo what the president is doing. So I have no problem with the president going around it.
You know, you look at what Khrushchev and --
SCIUTTO: But all those -- those --
GREEN: -- Kennedy did.
SCIUTTO: -- bureaucrats, you call them, as they testified, Vindman, Hill, it's -- you know, Bill Taylor, appointees of this president, I should note --
GREEN: Yes.
SCIUTTO: -- they were carrying out U.S. policy as stated not just by the president, but as authorized by Congress, which was to provide military aid to an ally. They weren't --
GREEN: Sure.
SCIUTTO: -- making this stuff up, you know. They weren't making it up for the hell of it.
GREEN: But -- but -- yeah, but if you go back and look at their testimony, Jim, I mean, it's pretty clear that their agenda was different than the president's agenda, and they were advancing their agenda. I mean, you can't look at their testimony and assume anything differently.
So I have no problem with the president saying, well, heck, I'm going to just send someone on my own behalf. I mean, Kennedy did that with Khrushchev and it worked pretty good. So, you know, I don't have a problem with that.
SCIUTTO: Congressman Mark Green, always good to have you on the program.
GREEN: Thanks, Jim.
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